Episode 12 - Dare to Believe: The Real Magic of Qigong

00:00:00: Welcome to Chigong Academy's podcast episode this week.

00:00:03: We have a special guest here, Lot and obviously John!

00:00:08: John

00:00:08: you've met Lot...a lot?

00:00:11: No not a lot I'm sorry for that Joe.

00:00:13: um do we want to tell us why you invited Lot today?

00:00:18: Oh well we-we met in Barlow though That was what three or four weeks ago wasn't it a thing?

00:00:25: Yeah And there was one particular conversation I can remember having and it was later in the day on, somebody had bought a bottle of wine.

00:00:35: we were sitting around with a glass of wine.

00:00:37: We shouldn't do this but let's be straight!

00:00:44: The benefits and the drawbacks of working with Chinese teachers, And the way that Qigong is taught.

00:00:52: We kind have covered it... ...and we were probably a little irreverent here.

00:00:56: but yeah I just thought this would be great conversation.

00:00:59: so i'm really chuffed to welcome you today Lot.

00:01:03: Thanks thank-you very much.

00:01:05: It's nice being here.

00:01:07: Do you like introducing yourself?

00:01:09: Relicated what do you do in all that?

00:01:13: Sure, sure.

00:01:14: My name is Lord Valhuyzen and I'm located in Amsterdam working as a full-time genetic teacher.

00:01:21: so every day i teach but also coach help people uh in the process of recovering or you know getting more happy more relaxed um Also giving treatments.

00:01:33: So this is it's a full time thing

00:01:39: Excellent!

00:01:40: And bit of TV personality as well here.

00:01:43: Well, yeah.

00:01:44: That's the crazy thing.

00:01:45: you know once they found me and then they keep on finding me.

00:01:49: so that super nice is it?

00:01:52: well It's always nice to spread Qigong also in like channels.

00:01:55: You normally wouldn't think to find people that would be interested.

00:02:00: So there was kind of funny to work for a TV channel that normally I don't frequently look and watch.

00:02:10: But yeah, so it's also there.

00:02:13: There are more people sort of waking up really looking for new ways in their lives to deal with all the pressures that is there or the stimuli finding ways for them to stay relaxed, to stay positive you know, looking at the world at a moment.

00:02:33: And just finding ways also to connect.

00:02:35: especially in Amsterdam we build nice community where people also connect and meet instead of being behind their own computers even doing a bit of movement but really talking connecting about deeper things over lives.

00:02:53: so trying to meet each other with an open heart And not only like running in, do your little class and run out again.

00:03:02: Like so many classes are here doing... So I always take my time.

00:03:05: Always am you know?

00:03:07: Running late got kicked out by the next chigong or a yoga teacher!

00:03:12: Oh god!

00:03:13: You know when we're yeah.. When were so deep in it....I enjoy it so much and i don't want to leave.

00:03:19: Don't wanna stop.

00:03:20: It's sometimes hard to get into with people especially when they're just starting and the t-field is not that strong yet for them, then you are there.

00:03:29: You don't want to stop!

00:03:33: So I do not even know why i started all this whole thing.

00:03:37: but what was your question?

00:03:43: No it's interesting.

00:03:46: my personal experiences... ...I kind of have been caught with people who love Qigong but I kind of hold my hand up and say, I find that i don't learn so much from being with a whole group of people who are passionate about Qigong.

00:04:06: There's a phrase that gets used about preaching to the choir, so if you go to church and it just feels like it can become an echo chamber.

00:04:17: Is everybody repeating same things with each other?

00:04:22: And when we push out into community or do kind of work... You start meeting people who have different opinions!

00:04:31: This feels much more like what Dr.

00:04:33: Pang was talking about, which is a far bigger practice as opposed to these weird little... And I'm not saying that I don't like it but you can get this weird little cliques that are just

00:04:45: there?

00:04:47: Yeah now i understand why he's telling me because when I told him on the channel they would normally be seen as those little cliquettes we're speaking of.

00:04:55: You know its different worlds and that also made me happy because they said it's a health and wellness trend of twenty-twenty six.

00:05:08: And then I was like, okay so you had this is how many thousand years is to go old?

00:05:14: Now suddenly It's a Health and Wellness Trend i can speak about on national television.

00:05:20: So that was fun!

00:05:21: Then also there This gorgeous looking guy interviewing me which normally Like as personal trainer such different energy, but he did it really nice.

00:05:33: He did a really good...he felt the tea.

00:05:35: so he spoke about like I felt something you know?

00:05:38: So yeah John i relate to that.

00:05:41: there's actually nice too surprise people that would normally never do their little chigung thing and then feel this is working!

00:05:50: You know this is really working..I am calming down ,i don't know what is happening ..I feel Of course, that's what we want.

00:06:00: We want to spread it and wake people up And have people in a different kind of consciousness like worldwide.

00:06:07: But this is happening anyway.

00:06:10: I think It was just who going to fill the void That apparently is there?

00:06:18: To be honest i was really a bit jealous When i was with Dr Joe Dispenser last week talking about everything Tigong talks about in a sort of the same way.

00:06:31: You know, setting this intention when you are on the T-field and you're at this Tigong state is totally the same!

00:06:38: And he's there with eight thousand people...and me we are here ten people maybe twenty years old.

00:06:45: When the master comes We have thirty or forty.

00:06:49: So how can we build this bridge?

00:06:53: between Qigong, which is I think actually much richer than just this story he was telling because that was only the information thing and meditation subject.

00:07:11: And we have also the body to work with... ...and the richness of the TCM to work in all forms.

00:07:18: so I would say Qigun is better You had to put it like simply.

00:07:26: And still, apparently we didn't bridge this gap.

00:07:29: so as you say in the little group that is living for understanding and practising how can we make it more accessible?

00:07:43: Why do you think that... Sorry, John!

00:07:46: What did you think of Joe Dismantle having eight thousand

00:07:50: people?!

00:07:51: And you may be just forward.

00:07:53: What do you think?

00:07:54: Are you asking me or are

00:07:55: I ask you?

00:08:00: and what's the difference about?

00:08:01: view it, I don't know.

00:08:02: perception of the Western people if we can say that.

00:08:05: Well, I think first of all he has a very good story.

00:08:09: You know He has done his research so he came.

00:08:12: but we as to go practitioners is no and believe he Has proven in The western way by Western methods.

00:08:23: So that is very strong, so... That's also for the western mind than easier to accept You know?

00:08:28: It's westernly proven.

00:08:30: Okay!

00:08:31: I can believe it.

00:08:34: And i just went to a Chinese guy who told me a lot and didn't understand much but knew he was right.

00:08:42: This is working.

00:08:45: this is truth Eingang, how do you call that?

00:08:51: So it's a different way in.

00:08:54: Ancients to the people's minds.

00:08:56: so then they believe and he just tells us story in brilliant ways really good.

00:09:01: And also his meditations are strong.

00:09:06: Also daddy tested right like using different kind of music to know where you go into theta state, coming from better and all that.

00:09:16: We just go in chigong state And we say afterwards oh I was really deep-in yeah me too.

00:09:21: Yeah That's very strong i had no thoughts.

00:09:24: He did it in the western way Where he knows You can go on different levels of your brain or brain circuits.

00:09:36: all this story about firing and wiring of neurons when you think differently.

00:09:42: All that is, it's brilliantly taught so I understand it attracts a lot of people.

00:09:47: Yeah

00:09:48: And i would say combine it with T'Gung then you have real magic in the hands.

00:09:54: Okay do anything?

00:09:55: It just working because people are seeing true stories The science... yeah off-that as well.

00:10:04: and then they decide to trust.

00:10:07: And when you can go deep into the meditation, so it's all about trust and improvement or is just about trust?

00:10:13: Or both for...

00:10:16: Trusting to trust trusting too dare to believe.

00:10:20: I think For us It's to go beyond them.

00:10:22: We we So meeting your two selves in connection with like The bigger the oneness of the dowel.

00:10:31: So then there's this, it's more of a belief like religious people.

00:10:38: And he is just saying exactly the same.

00:10:39: but He comes from point where we're not going to trust him when he doesn't come up with good research and good evidence.

00:10:47: so he's delivering that.

00:10:50: But of course he did heal his back The way we heal.

00:10:56: So yeah, I think if we could tell the Tigum story a bit more westernly based like Western-based evidence Maybe we could have better ancients and then add The movements.

00:11:09: but that's just your thought.

00:11:10: It comes up now.

00:11:13: Yeah, I completely agree with you on it And I love the idea of there to believe.

00:11:17: um i think that That is just such a great phrase.

00:11:22: I mean, we've had conversations about the benefits that you get from Chinese teachers.

00:11:29: But quite a lot of the Chinese teachers... What i found is it can be difficult to draw the line between where they're teaching Qigong and their Chinese culture?

00:11:40: And in order for this to be broadly acceptable to Western audience We need to recognise those lines.

00:11:49: To give an idea there's some stuff being promoted at the moment which some of the supposedly high-level jigong teachers, but typically they all present wearing Chinese clothes standing on a mountain or standing next to beautiful stream and it'll There's this undertone if you've got be more Chinese in order good at.

00:12:11: This mm-hmm And I think its.

00:12:15: i Think it's interesting because I think that we can remove ourselves from our cultural norms.

00:12:20: We can see our cultural norm.

00:12:21: so I think we have an advantage as Westerners, because it's asking us to be very different.

00:12:28: But at the same time I feel like this is exactly what you're talking about.

00:12:33: Joda spends his talk straight into a western audience giving them exactly that they want whereas the fact its being taught in a very Chinese system tends to over mystify and make it a little bit more esoteric?

00:12:49: Because we can't grasp it!

00:12:51: That's what I love, you know?

00:12:55: So this is difficult because they're not understanding part.

00:13:02: Yeah

00:13:02: so that exactly...that thing we hold down and things when it gets really complicated like hmm okay You know i don't understand them but yeah But thats me huh maybe that is different in there.

00:13:20: Yeah, and I think to an extent well.

00:13:22: I think i do agree with you You know?

00:13:24: I'm I love working with a broad range of people because I keep on saying all these different pathways that are going through this thing in the middle That I The more I work around it the less I feel like can ever go anywhere near explaining what that thing is.

00:13:38: I can just see There's kind of a place of convergence that lots of different people come back too.

00:13:45: It's just sometimes I feel with Qigong as if We can kind of see the path, but with what we've done is... ...we found this amazing viewpoint and stand on it as if we have arrived.

00:13:59: It doesn't give us that connection into it!

00:14:03: But I say....I don't know.

00:14:06: You mean which connection?

00:14:09: I think.....it moves in to the realms of spiritual bypassing.

00:14:16: So, what I mean by that is people will go into... ...what they perceive to be a deep Qigong state.

00:14:23: But what their actually doing?

00:14:25: it's just hiding from reality.

00:14:26: They're not accessing oneness.. ..they are not accessing the real kind of core of whats in there.

00:14:35: There an aspect of it.

00:14:36: if i can go here and hide all this stuff thats going on my life And I don't need to address it, you know.

00:14:45: Howler howler howlar everything's going be lovely and i'm not sure about that.

00:14:51: um...I think we need a way of being able to step away from the things that trouble us but we also need a path through to place where they can take us.

00:15:03: Yeah!

00:15:03: But I think there is big difference in what you describe.

00:15:09: That is also, you don't see that just in Tigong people saying how long and wearing some funny clothes.

00:15:17: And then they're like sort of enlightened or claim to be.

00:15:21: it's not bad.

00:15:21: I mean if your serious in Tegung and setting a serious tea field You are not doing just form because there was lot of people do the forms But following their verses and set your teafield right take time for your true intention when you're there.

00:15:41: I think you are really working with information, so then you understand that it's not just about saying oh its all halal and... but do you might be right?

00:15:56: I talked to somebody who has been doing tigong for fifteen years And they said what is an intention?

00:16:02: how can we don't know?

00:16:05: And then I was trying to explain it and how you work with that.

00:16:08: Then he said, well this is kind of Akrabadabra?

00:16:12: What have you been

00:16:13: doing?!

00:16:16: So Dennis like maybe just a short cut too less thinking for an hour... ...and go back into normal life.

00:16:23: but if we follow some good workshops.... You need to understand what its all about!

00:16:32: It's hard to miss But you have to educate the people that come to you like in Amsterdam.

00:16:39: There's such a culture of just running with your yoga pen and thinking, You can be enlightened by talking about it for an hour or something.

00:16:49: And then if I really start telling them what its all about How is works?

00:16:55: Want their patience also set at a G field That takes ten minutes The people who stay really get it and grow rapidly.

00:17:07: And the people that are just not looking for all they go, you know?

00:17:11: You lose them but that's okay.

00:17:14: so... But I think in Chinenjigun it is deep!

00:17:21: People understand very well.

00:17:22: Absolutely

00:17:23: yeah i think.

00:17:26: coming back to one of your bits which you were mentioning there I mean, we've all been at these places that you go into a Qigong workshop and people start to introduce themselves.

00:17:40: And it goes around the room... It sounds like a bit of pissing contest!

00:17:45: How far can i pee up the wall?

00:17:47: You know..I have trained in China three times for twenty years or I have been there four time and I have trained twenty five years.

00:17:57: actually what I found is Oh, yeah.

00:17:59: You

00:17:59: know

00:18:03: I'm not denying this but the thing that i've found fascinating is that The people I tend to learn the most from aren't the People who have been stuck in their ways?

00:18:11: Who's been doing it for many Many years.

00:18:13: uh-huh people who just come In and they're done something mind blowing with a practice That you'd never even considered.

00:18:20: They got caught in the structure there Have Not Got Caught in There or I mean my Whatever Year And I've Been Here This Many Times.

00:18:28: Yeah

00:18:29: They've

00:18:29: just gone and done it.

00:18:30: And I think those people, we need to go.

00:18:33: oh you're amazing teachers!

00:18:36: Yeah i read about that yeah... That's true but..I don't experience that so much being in a pissing context.

00:18:43: So thats why was joking?

00:18:46: I think because then your coming from a lot of ego Which is if you are training alot which not the thing you normally do Even, you know with the trainers meeting that Chigong teaches last month.

00:19:02: I didn't experience that so much.

00:19:04: people were trying to like oh well i've been doing this for ten years or twenty and Like people think even how further they are the more modest They become like this German woman.

00:19:19: I love to have, you know just a train with her as she's been doing it for thirteen years or something.

00:19:23: Just so nice!

00:19:27: What is your name?

00:19:30: Louisa.

00:19:33: Yes he's amazing but we're all enjoying and learning new things.

00:19:47: I don't know about the other forms.

00:19:49: The more you go into IG and form, This is why I really have a problem with people just teaching the form and thinking, this has to be perfectly like this.

00:20:07: Oh no!

00:20:08: No...this is wrong you know?

00:20:10: So what are you

00:20:11: doing?!

00:20:12: I get people in my class that were with colleagues And they're really traumatised because their arm was wrong You know?

00:20:20: They were corrected even on the G field You know, no they're not like that.

00:20:25: It's impossible.

00:20:28: if you come from a place of love and joy just feeling the body exploring how can it be so important?

00:20:38: I think this is ego which should be avoided because then people cannot relax.

00:20:47: Yeah but i think there also possibly talks to one other things we were mentioning before we started the recording.

00:20:54: When we talk about the way that Qigong is taught in China, compared to how Qigeng was taught in the West I think maybe... We learn in different ways so The adjustments that we get Maybe it disrupts us far more than what happened with the Chinese way of learning where it's like.

00:21:18: oh thank you I don't know.

00:21:22: And, and i think there's a question about how do we teach effectively when we're working in a culture that the system was never designed for?

00:21:31: Yeah!

00:21:32: That's...that's a brilliant question John because first you have to know How Do People Learn Here?

00:21:38: You have of course this way ...you know what.

00:21:41: We all learn it different ways.

00:21:43: also There is not one Western Way.

00:21:45: Also Of course, there's this huge cultural difference in that we're also trying to bridge and it is a bit impossible.

00:21:56: For me I hear so many people say... ...that this the only time of week.

00:22:02: they don't have to be perfect.

00:22:05: So then you don't live up all expectations or things like just being.

00:22:14: I can just follow that.

00:22:15: And of course, i correct because then you get more out of the practice if we stretch the right muscle or the right meridian Of course but it should be like so not important compared to The joy of learning how to relax deeply accepting everything and yourself Everything that's there Just enjoying.

00:22:42: So to be honest, I have more problems with Chinese teachers trying to correct my form than the Westerns wanting so much.

00:22:55: You know?

00:22:55: Have you

00:22:59: ever

00:22:59: met a Chinese person who is not a teacher and can tell how that person perceives the Chinese teachers or maybe even western?

00:23:13: Oh, that's also very... That would be nice probably.

00:23:16: You know?

00:23:18: I don't think we met one.

00:23:19: did we...?

00:23:22: I think it is interesting because possibly we have.

00:23:25: but when i've been in those situations where the Chinese teacher coming around to correct.. ..I can feel a part of me going ''I've been practicing for this long and teaching for this''.

00:23:35: I should.

00:23:35: now how do this!

00:23:39: The only person who has put on my is me And it's not the Chinese teacher, but yet somehow we blame The Teacher who is walking towards us.

00:23:47: But It all our junk that we're seeing.

00:23:51: and then there's a

00:23:52: frame of reference You know coming up saying for me?

00:23:56: Of course

00:23:57: Yeah.

00:23:57: So you know it could be that the teachers that we work with are deeply aware of it.

00:24:01: We're just blind to the fact that we also caught up in Our sense of what we should be doing.

00:24:10: I don't know.

00:24:12: I think it's fascinating to play with the idea, because i think it needs playing.

00:24:15: Well

00:24:18: yeah and it keeps a bit of mystery in the mystic life right?

00:24:23: If you if you think they might be like certain on different level than we are working in a different way... Because that is the magic we also look for.

00:24:37: so when we perceive it differently but i'm a bit afraid!

00:24:42: It's not like It's just that.

00:24:45: Well, yeah I don't know because there is also the language barrier.

00:24:49: you're talking about them like this.

00:24:53: still English-wise it's not easy You know?

00:24:58: Yeah but then There was something.

00:25:00: one of the teachers That i had for a number Of years wasn't with Incheoneng as within One The other systems He Had A really Bad Stammer and he Couldn'T get His Words out But English was his native language.

00:25:15: And it's fascinating to learn with him because when he was saying something, He'd get a word and you couldn't get out!

00:25:23: In your head going I know what you're gonna say.

00:25:25: Because then he would say something completely different.

00:25:32: Oh okay...I wasn't expecting that!

00:25:35: When i learned with native english speaking teachers or people with very good English I expect everything they say to be accurate, whereas when i learned with the Chinese teacher there's always a question about what did they mean?

00:25:50: Because it is not first language and there's scope for... There's scope to interpret.

00:25:57: And I think that there's far greater scope of learning.

00:26:00: again!

00:26:00: Again this restriction we have in our first language.

00:26:06: as somebody who has only really got one language it's a restriction I'm really painfully aware of.

00:26:14: Well yeah, well that's beautifully put.

00:26:16: so then the magic only comes from...from the language barrier.

00:26:20: huh to put in like a bit simple.

00:26:23: but um said there is more magic or all-more.

00:26:28: uh ...well more to consider for yourself what's going on.

00:26:32: i understand .I was thinking about Master Lee ,i don't know if you know him.

00:26:38: he wrote a book in Dutch.

00:26:40: It's bringing home the heart, I think it's an English and he is his English if kind of poor to be honest.

00:26:48: but i actually love The way He teaches.

00:26:52: And maybe because yeah you can go To sort Of a different place Because the only thing he says Is Love Love Love the Chiefield Love With Love.

00:27:02: No!

00:27:03: Love Love Your Lover.

00:27:07: It's all the time, but you know okay I get it.

00:27:10: It's about love.

00:27:11: Okay and But he is probably in that information at a T field.

00:27:16: how we didn't talk about that yet?

00:27:17: He of course sending out his information on this t-field when we connect.

00:27:21: so So then Daniel also part of the magic like ok You know just makes sense.

00:27:26: i really loved That.

00:27:28: later if your listens like my didn't even say so much So, but I still prefer to go his lectures than just have.

00:27:40: you know it's like maybe he say somebody is explaining in perfect English and there

00:27:47: isn't

00:27:48: much magic.

00:27:49: What does love mean?

00:27:52: Love is a word which is pretty overused.

00:27:56: so how would describe that context?

00:28:02: So nice question!

00:28:05: in that context.

00:28:06: Well, I think if we start Qigong very often to an empty goon people at start want to heal themselves just like i did and you just wanna get better.

00:28:20: And they say in the start They said it's not about that It is actually meeting your true self or finding yourself.

00:28:26: Yeah sure!

00:28:27: Just wanted walk again Go skiing be able to cycle things like that, but you know doing it longer and then understanding what healing is about how that all works.

00:28:41: You found out... It's about love and self-love mainly coming from a much more loving place inside having this loving conversation with yourself instead of picking on you As he says, it's creating a T-field inside full of love.

00:29:08: So you're creating the right atmosphere inside and then at least having good time living your life.

00:29:16: so I think cultivating that Love inside also sending love to all organs but especially never looking down on yourself always treating yourselves as Buddha as Dr.

00:29:29: Tang said, you're really never looking down on yourself in any way.

00:29:38: that is a quite important task we have.

00:29:41: so then it's yeah I hope that covers the word love than...

00:29:47: I guess i got an image from a house which was your inside and you just put your street shoes off like the Japanese culture.

00:29:58: Yeah, take care that everything is clean and nice and cozy.

00:30:01: And maybe some candles or all that stuff which could be Maybe some kind of an image inside of you?

00:30:07: And then do just create the atmosphere That every day's worth to live.

00:30:11: but everyday Is a Day.

00:30:13: who would like to get up because You liked the atmosphere your life to grow Your life potential kind Of that?

00:30:22: it's Just An Image Which Came Up Into My Mind.

00:30:26: But Thank You For The Description.

00:30:28: I like it.

00:30:28: Yeah,

00:30:29: you too!

00:30:30: I just want to clear up that

00:30:31: door because...

00:30:33: Love love love.

00:30:34: Yes John go

00:30:35: on.

00:30:35: What did he say

00:30:35: for you?

00:30:36: Oh well i was keeping quiet for a reason Exactly!

00:30:40: I thought so

00:30:44: Look..I've really struggled with what love is and one of the things which shook me was the difference between unconditional and conditional.

00:31:00: You know, if you love something and expect something in return as opposed to if you just love something... And I think i got quite caught up on that.

00:31:11: but what i've just heard you talk about there..I could never describe that as love because I don't feel as if I know what Love is.

00:31:21: it's just- I played with the idea too much!

00:31:23: It's Got Too Confusing!

00:31:27: but what I've heard is, what i would describe as the ability to listen without judgment.

00:31:34: To observe...to hold lightly..to nourish ..to nurture all of the ideas that I hold within those places ...is what I just heard you talk about.

00:31:44: ,but You have used a description thats far simpler.

00:31:48: But unfortunately I need something a bit more complicated in order to understand it.

00:31:54: I thought so, yeah you like to think deeply.

00:32:04: Unfortunately yes!

00:32:05: So that's easier when language is very simple then because then you can just stick for that.

00:32:11: and well but i think all this true.

00:32:15: All is true, all of what you're saying.

00:32:17: Of course it's beautiful if you can show up in that way to other people

00:32:27: But isn't important?

00:32:28: That every individual person needs to think about or feel about What's love for me and maybe the inner self?

00:32:43: I don't think so because you're thinking about

00:32:47: it.

00:32:47: So for

00:32:47: me, wouldn't make sense.

00:32:49: I'm a duo.

00:32:51: talk about how you learn on just to do what?

00:32:53: You know i went to university and now...I thought How did I do

00:32:58: that?!

00:32:58: Because I am actually the person who is like Just doing

00:33:01: it!

00:33:02: And

00:33:03: just enjoying and feeling and doing sports.

00:33:05: so I would think You could think your way into what love is.

00:33:12: I think you just feel and then, oh that feeling...I recognise that feeling.

00:33:16: That's like

00:33:21: a song lyric.

00:33:23: Yeah well exactly because you said What Is Love?

00:33:26: And i was immediately People Don't Hurt Me.

00:33:29: So yeah

00:33:32: Well there are nine things.

00:33:34: When

00:33:34: have you recognised that you're a doer person?

00:33:40: Well, that's also a very good question.

00:33:42: I didn't...I think i wanted to be professional skier but in the family I grew up there was supposed to be you know top sports with universities better.

00:33:54: so as I went to university and then um But I'd loved skiing and I loved sports And just love doing it too being interested or really intrigued by what I was doing at that time, with Foreign Affairs and French which is something else like now.

00:34:19: Actually we're still in foreign affairs because you know... We are meeting each other on the T-field exchanging and trying to make the world a better place.

00:34:29: but then i think it's ...I found out about Hockey because then they explained a lot and I was just listening like, little bit like that.

00:34:42: And when we start doing it people started playing oh dad!

00:34:46: So i had to see it.

00:34:48: so I have the problem of listening too.

00:34:50: It's also for me good thing about Qigong.

00:34:53: try talk as less than you can let them feel how words but still this western mind needs to be fat.

00:35:03: You do need explain stuff which I actually think is a bit of waste, well not a waste of time but i prefer just to hang out in the tea field and then share information through the teafield.

00:35:18: And not with words... But we have to you know otherwise they don't understand them.

00:35:25: They won't be able to use it in their way.

00:35:28: We know its possible.

00:35:29: so..we do have to explain.

00:35:35: It's kind of a lovely circle back to where we started from because, you know We're starting too.

00:35:42: To me what?

00:35:43: What were talking about here is the fact that we need the frameworks.

00:35:46: We need the structures We need to recognize the way that we explore as individuals But we mustn't get caught in the words.

00:35:54: We must not get caught In the framework.

00:35:56: so he wasn't getting caught in stories Because when searching for his beyond.

00:36:02: So you spoke about Joe Dispenser and the story.

00:36:04: You spoke of how he talks stuff, but Qigong offers this ability to do... I'm a doer!

00:36:15: Much as yes i am a thinker but not

00:36:19: a do-er.

00:36:20: And so therefore Qigung offers me a really rich framework in order to explore.

00:36:27: But if I wasn't Maybe I've been more of a Joe Dispenser Acolyte, but actually it doesn't matter.

00:36:37: It's all paths up the same mountain.

00:36:42: Yeah in the end... In the end it does.

00:36:46: But its also about the willingness to really open-up To go into this oneness and allow yourself to be there And be with your self you know, really meet yourself in all possible ways.

00:37:05: And also for the emotions that come up and want to come

00:37:09: out.".

00:37:11: This is a big discussion of why do people heal?

00:37:14: Why don't they

00:37:15: heal?".

00:37:16: I think exactly... That's what you described like half an hour ago.

00:37:22: when people do Qigong but don't really do their work so consciousness doesn't develop.

00:37:29: The emotions don't come out People don't really meet themselves in all their nasty habits or bad thoughts about the world and themselves, you know.

00:37:42: The thing that they're doing... ...the energy you are creating is what you put into the T-field for others of yourself Doing that labour and working with it.

00:37:57: I think that is key.

00:37:59: and if you're just doing it as a sort of, well the health and wellness trend way then there's no magic.

00:38:11: And then there is no waking up.

00:38:15: but I'm positive about the world wanting to wake up in doing it and starting because i think this process does unstoppable And that is like, how do you know?

00:38:31: Because I feel sometimes the energy change around me.

00:38:35: So then I know yeah this is true but can we sell this magic to a big group of Western people who are there in their western way?

00:38:54: so they come back again

00:38:59: Just as you were speaking there, I wrote down when you spoke earlier which is why keep on looking down here.

00:39:04: Dare to believe and that's... There was something when you said it to me that kind of embraced all of that And i think part of that also going the paths we have are hugely precious but if we marketise them into machines behind the prominent people like Joe Dispenser, well yeah we can name many.

00:39:37: I'm not sure whether that takes you as far because at some point they'll get caught in a marketing place by.

00:39:46: the next course goes to training.

00:39:49: Learn level three now learn level four and i think actually that simplicity of dare-to-believe is is so important and maybe we don't need to be as big of that.

00:40:01: Maybe just naturally grow, who knows?

00:40:05: Oh John yeah thank you for saying that.

00:40:08: because exactly this I think the more busy in marketing are not able spend their time training yourself.

00:40:17: really do your work.

00:40:22: So the more you engage in making money with it and then, I'm making a big.

00:40:28: You lose the connection maybe just to be with yourself?

00:40:31: And...and I am so happy that last year I chose to trade more for myself than have less business.

00:40:41: Have smaller classes or spend less time PR everything.

00:40:46: Just do work!

00:40:49: Then people will come by themselves, or the right people would come exactly as you say.

00:40:56: But that could maybe take longer I don't know but at least then you're sending out the right energy for yourself.

00:41:04: yeah

00:41:05: absolutely

00:41:07: so that's true and i think we can go to two days of a week and say hallelujah and then go back to your normal life.

00:41:15: nothing changes.

00:41:18: Jigum should make the difference because then we say, you know You have to practice every day.

00:41:23: Yeah just do it a work.

00:41:24: But that's also.

00:41:25: he says that too.

00:41:28: He says the two but I don't.

00:41:29: if they do and how far they can come by themselves at least We have all the exercises that we can do

00:41:38: at home to yeah

00:41:39: going?

00:41:39: Yes That said i had A monty python moment life of Brian moment when you said that It's not so much that the people who like Joe Dispens is telling you to do these things But it's a bit like the moment in life of Brian where, you know brine is.

00:41:56: There's there's a thing with the shoe and he holds up the shoe And everyone starts worshiping the shoe.

00:42:02: And and it's just like no stop it You know okay?

00:42:06: It's for you to Do The work.

00:42:07: but everybody turns up in awe Of These People and In awe of the yeah Space They Create.

00:42:15: they managed to disempower themselves and prevent themselves from finding their vast potential.

00:42:24: That may never have been the intention, but because that's the way it...they engage.

00:42:30: they tend to feel this person is going to heal me.

00:42:31: Maybe that's just a... I might have just had a massive can of worms and i feel as if maybe, this is another episode!

00:42:38: Well it's very interesting topic indeed because then you're making a guru out of it or something like putting somebody higher which has never been Dr Pung intended.

00:42:49: so yeah true He would never want that, you know.

00:42:56: But it could be happening because there's so much easier to put somebody there and worship someone else instead of going inside thinking they know everything.

00:43:06: Yeah And then... There we go again.

00:43:10: I've just understood something more about what you said about love So thankyou.

00:43:17: Well thats good.

00:43:18: Thank you too for this super nice conversation.

00:43:22: Thank you.

00:43:22: Do want to share some information where people can find you or something?

00:43:27: Yeah, if you google Chinengti-Gung in Amsterdam You might as well Find me but you could also do Chinengtigong less like chinengtygonglesson.nl Less.

00:43:39: then you'll find me.

00:43:40: or Xunyuanji therapy Netherlands that we have...you can also find this there.

00:43:49: Yeah, I think if you Google a lot of Elheiser you'll find me in the end schedule like private session or as a group session or coaching whatever.

00:44:01: All right.

00:44:02: Thank You very much.

00:44:03: thank you for listening and watching.

00:44:06: We see our listen to each other next week.

00:44:10: take care.